Sunday March 17, 2024. Natascha drove down to Red Bluff in Southern Humboldt County, with her father and son to meet up with Soulshine on their property to talk glass. Inspired by their work she had seen at Summer Arts and Music, as well as their last shop in Eureka, and their fun-ky Facebook podcast. Her quest was to find out ‘What’s next?’

Natascha: Thank you for meeting with me today. I’m Natascha from the Little Lost Forest blog. I’m excited to learn more about Soulshine and your new space here in Southern Humboldt. How are you guys doing today?

Ember: I’m doing awesome.

Willow: Yeah, we’re really, really enjoying this spring day.

Natascha: Ember and Willow, welcome back from Wisconsin. How was your trip?

Ember: We were in Wyoming. [They mentioned they did have a studio in the past in Wisconsin, Natascha messed up.] And the trip was awesome.

Willow: It was awesome. We were there for, like, six weeks.

Ember: We really enjoy going to different studios, which we got to do in Wyoming. We got to teach and help them develop classes and product and then we also got to blow glass of our own. So, it was just a really awesome situation. Sam and Alicia, they’re awesome people. We had a great time.

Natascha: That sounds like so much fun.

Ember: Hoping to do more with them in the future. So that’s kind of fun and exciting for us. So, moving in more than one direction. But at the same time, we’re going to get to blow glass, we’re going to get to teach. So, a couple of our passions.

Willow: Yeah. Lots of exciting things.

Natascha: Right on. I watched a video on your website. It mentioned that you’ve been blowing glass for 19 years. Is that still accurate?

Willow: Uh, I have been blowing glass since 1994. So, this is 30 years this year.

Natascha: Wow. Congratulations. Woohoo! How about you?

Ember: I’ve been blowing glass. I actually took glassblowing in college. I don’t know if I should even say what year it was. It was a very long time ago. But I also, at the same time, had three kids living on the mountain and really got into that for a while. And I think I’ve been back into glassblowing full-time since 2010.

Natascha: What’s your process like? Do you sketch out your artwork before creating it, or do you prefer to work spontaneously?

Willow: I think both. Sometimes you’re making things that have to fit in a box, because it’s an order for something. And other times you’re making things, where you have to share a vision with other artists and you have to be able to kind of have a plan for that. It can just flow as it go(es) kind of thing. But everybody needs to understand the same kind of end goal. So, that each person can find where they fit into that collaborative team. It’s hard to do that. You know, when you’re by yourself and you’re just going for it, making shit, then you can just be open and free.

Ember: I think that’s one of the things that you’re really good at is in a collaborative class teaching situation, you do, he does a great job at actually drawing out the plan, organizing people so that everybody’s got a part, and a job. And it’s kind of somewhat defined as- not as far as what artwork they’re doing, but where that part will be on the piece. And that, I think is a talent of yours. It’s super helpful in teaching and collaborating with other artists. Yeah.

Natascha: Lovely. Your artwork features brilliant and smooth colors. What’s your favorite palette to work with?

Willow: I think I have some crazy ideas. I think the best color palette we get are the ones where, uh, where I let Amber pick the colors.

Natascha: Ooh.

Willow: Wait, you know, not even that. I like when she just drives the ship. She’s like, this is what it’s gonna be. And I love it because then I…

Ember: We, like, you know, go back and forth, we go…

Willow: Back and forth like we always battle between; I like bold black line outlines, you know what I mean? Like, I like everything to look like a traditional tattoo, you know, with a really fat black outline and a bold image, like a sticker, like you would see a bright poster image.

Ember: I like all the colors between.

Willow: So, she wants it like, white and, like, she wants white in between every line.

Ember: I don’t just like white, I like all the colors!

Willow: And I want black in between every line. And so somewhere between white and black, you have to find a balance, you know. But as far as the colors together, I don’t really have a good sense of that. Like, she definitely influences that unless I know like I’m gonna do a fire water palette, but then I know. Well, all right, I’m gonna pick the fire colors and then the water colors and then- But otherwise if I don’t go with what she says…

Ember: I love color.

Willow: If I don’t go with what her plan is then…

Ember: -If it has purple and fuchsia. Yeah, right. You know, bright, beautiful green. Oh, yeah. Just the drippy, yummy stuff that just makes you want to kind of drool a little at the mouth and makes your eyes just kind of pop and your heart like, whoa.

Willow: You can’t argue with that. You gotta be like, fuck yeah, right. This is the perfect blend, right?

Ember: Throw some sparkles in there.

Willow: If it was up to me, it would be like; yeah, it’s black and white and purple and blue and yellow and green and like, holy shit balls. You know what I mean?

Ember: We have fun with color together. Yeah.

Natascha: I dig it. What is the learning process like for mastering glassblowing?

Willow: Hours is powers. [pause] It’s how you get to Carnegie Hall, right? You got too hours with powers, right? That’s the same thing. It’s like. Hours is powers. If you want to do anything. It’s not really about how talented you are or how smart you are, or how dumb you are or how cool you are, it’s about how much do you want to do that thing, and how much are you willing to dedicate your life to doing that thing.

Ember: So, passion, passion does come in there because hours, you still have to have passion for that medium. Uh, I like think about glass all the time and how much I actually love the medium. Like I was just, for some reason, thinking about it the other night. And I was thinking about how I look at it has changed over the years. And now, where at one time I was afraid, kind of, for when I’d get the glass so hot that it would just flow and move. Now I get off on that. I like, love it. I love how it gets so soft and movement and I can control and make the movement happen. It’s really symbiotic feeling. I love that feeling of symbiosis with the medium. I think that is really…

Willow: Yeah. It’s like an extension of your hand.

Ember: Or your whole body. More, more beyond that. Yeah. Your passion.

Natascha: What are some of the dangers and risks associated with glassblowing?

Willow: Uh, you get addicted to glassblowing. It’s just like.

Ember: It’s like it’s addicting.

Willow: Kind of like crack or heroin or any of those kinds of drugs, really.

Ember: Let’s refer to it as bitten by the glass bug. It’s a little bit nicer. It’s happier, I like it.

Willow: It’s really hard on your bank account. You gotta be dedicated and willing to bust your ass. And so, you gotta be willing to be rich, be poor, be rich, you’re poor, you’re rich, you’re really poor, you’re rich, you’re poor. And that’s like how it is. And if you’re lucky, there’s a you’re rich part that’s like enough to save enough money that you can, like, actually buy groceries. You know, like it’s a commitment that you’re like, this is what I’m gonna do. And some people, they just have another job and they just do that on the side. And those are some people that got a pretty good idea sometimes because it’s hard. It’s hard. And so, it’s hard on that. You know I don’t think like other risks. Like you’re not going to blow your ass up. Maybe. People get burned, but I, I think the pizza taking pizza out of the oven is way sketchier. I don’t know. I get a lot of little cuts that like, they’re just tiny little cuts, you know, but they’re in like a shitty spot and then you get them, like, all over, and then suddenly you have like 8 or 9 and you’re like, I have some kind of curse of the 10,000 cuts and these. That sucks really bad.

Ember: You know what? I get cut, I get burned, and I, I don’t know, it’s still like, somehow, I hardly even feel it. I just want to get back and do it more.

Willow: You get superpowers.

Ember: Yeah, yeah.

Willow: You just like, gotta push through it.

Ember: Yeah. I got the worst burn on my hand right here.

Willow: Oh yeah, that hot graphite.

Ember: I dropped a graphite tool. And I tried to catch it because I didn’t want it to break on the floor because, you know, they’re expensive.

Willow: It didn’t, it didn’t break.

Ember: It didn’t break, but it burned my hand pretty bad.

Willow: That graphite. Don’t fucking play. That graphite like, just fucking hurts.

Ember: But aloe is a wonderful thing. Aloe and a little lanacane.

Willow: And weed.

Ember: And weed.

Willow: I’ve heard, that weed is really good for that.

Ember: I don’t know.

Willow: I heard that, yeah.

Ember: I think so. I yeah, I smoked, I did try, I used it, it seemed to help.

Natascha: Talking about budgets, what aspects of glassblowing tends to be more expensive and are there ways for beginners to start on a budget?

Willow: Ooh, glass is expensive.

Willow: I think that (where) there is a will, there is a way. I think you can totally start on a budget. Willow will kind of say the opposite. He’s like, buy the giant torch, spend all the money right away. But I don’t feel that way. I feel like starting out at your comfortable spot and working your way that direction. Because even if you buy yourself a small torch, I think buying yourself the largest, the best, hottest, small torch or a torch that you can work with, I don’t know. You’ll have to get out there on the glass classifieds and look for somebody who’s no longer interested or upgrading. People upgrade all the time.

So starting out small with a torch that you can afford and working your way up. As you get better, you’ll be able to sell more things and put that money back into your glassblowing. Just like if you had any type of business or something passionate that you were about you would take whatever money came that way and put it back into it, you know? So, I think that is a really good thing to do with glassblowing because you can start out and if you’re really strong and passionate about doing this, you’re going to find a way and you’re going to make those really awesome pendants, those little things, those sculptures or those small pieces that make you happy. You’re going to go out there and you’re going to show them to people. You’re going to share your love, your passion for what you’ve made, and people are going to want part of that. And then you’re going to be able to build your kind of pocket full of things you can do, and that you have, you know, to get through life with. And put that back into your business and get more color, get a bigger torch, and keep moving forward. Because just like life glass is a journey.

Natascha: Wonderful. Can you share some advanced techniques that you guys have mastered?

Willow: We do a lot of sectional montage and linework techniques. Ember does a lot of incredible sculptural pieces that we bring together, like the two a lot, and that has been some of the best kind of things we’ve been doing lately.

Ember: Yeah, I love when we just, like, come up with an idea and I get to sculpt some amazing picture that came into my mind and make it three-dimensional out of glass. I love it. It’s amazing. And then we get to put that together with some amazing shapes that Willow comes up with color and we work together.

Willow (whispers): She picks the colors.

Ember: We do some awesome stuff together at the same time. Like, my love for glass doesn’t stop at lampworking. I really love working out of the furnace and making big pieces of glass work, which involves a lot of body movement. It’s a whole nother part of the medium. And it’s one of the awesome things about the medium is I feel like it’s endless learning. So, if you’re one of those people who likes to be challenged, you love learning. I feel like I could keep learning about different parts and areas of glass my whole life and still not feel like I’ve touched everything. So that’s exciting.

Natascha: Yeah, it’s humble coming from such a master. Super cool. Is it possible to accidentally burn the glass during the blowing process?

Ember: Mm mm. Interesting. Yes. Depending on the type of glass, you can.

Willow: You can boil the glass by heating it with two forceful and hot of a flame or whatever you’re heating it with at one time. And you’re blasting it so hard that the surface boils before the heat can radiate into the core of the piece, like thermodynamics. Right? It’s like a pot pie. It stays hot in the middle, and it cools from the outside, but it has to heat up the same way, because glass is an insulator and it’s going to pull its heat into the core. That’s what makes it gather into a round ball or something like that. And so any flame that you put to it, it’s gonna get hot and it’s gonna melt. But if you like, heat it on high, it’s gonna boil the rice, you know, and you don’t want to boil the rice, and you want to simmer the rice really slowly. And so when it can hold that water in and absorb that, you know, then you have that perfect rice. And it’s the same thing with the glass. It wants to be heated in the right kind of flame for the situation. Even different kinds of glass, different…

Willow: –colors.

Ember: Different colors. Yeah. Uh, have different chemicals or reactive properties that sometimes you want to boil. You want to boil the rice, sometimes a little bit that you get to break the rules or bend the rules. And then there’s other times that you want to like activate the system and you heat the glass and when you heat it, in a different kind of flame, different shit happens, you know what I mean?

Molecules inside the matrix get to float to the surface and create different colors or different effects. Right?

-Ember

Ember: Yeah.

Willow: Kind of like that.

Natascha: Yeah. That was a really good answer.

Willow: Is it too sciency?

Natascha: No, that was so cool.

Willow: Fucking science shit’s awesome.

Natascha: I think so too. Yeah. What’s your favorite type of piece to create?

Ember: I love creating sculptural pieces. I pretty much do a lot of sculptural pieces that I would want to put on functional pieces. And I do a lot of sculptural pieces. I like to make pendants so that people could wear them.

Natascha: What kind of themes do you like to use?

Ember: Um, mostly themes from nature. I love everything about the world in nature, and I love flowers, I love animals, I love trees, I love, yeah. And I actually get really inspired by colors of nature, I don’t know.

Natascha: How about you, Willow? Favorite type of piece to create?

Willow: I like to work with line work, and what that means is that I make a tube that’s a hollow tube but has like encased different colors all around it. So, it’s a lined tube that’s hollow. And I make that first, and then I pull that out, and when I pull it out, I get about four feet of that same color, really dense color, lined tube. And then I take that one piece and I rip it up into like 30 smaller pieces of line tubing, and then I twist them all together in different ways and then reassemble them back together in different ways often on like a 90 degree off-axis. And then there’s all this math that goes into it, and, uh, I get really into shape with the math formula of taking the spirals and stacking them together and reassembling the sections to make more patterns. And then if I make this many here and, you know, three, three, three, anyway, you know what I mean? It gets all mathy. But I like to create patterns like through that with the lines, by reassembling the lines and create really elegant forms. I think I really like extreme flat like transitions, you know, like, I don’t know, instead of slopey bubbles. I like to be, like, cut shapes. Yeah.

Natascha: Ember, now I hear what you mean about the shapes.

Willow: And it’s all math, though. That puts that back together again. That’s the… I don’t know, I sucked at math in school.

Natascha: I did too, I’m not good at math.

Ember: Math’s not my favorite thing at all.

Natascha: But now you’re using math in a different way and it is how you connect with it now.

Willow: That’s how I see math, I guess, all along.

They [teachers] didn’t show me that, like, hey, you can take a spiral and put three spirals together and it makes this other spiral.

-Willow

I’d be like, oh shit, there you go. I get the math. I’d have gotten an A. [laughter] They just didn’t teach me like that. They just taught me the other way. Yeah. You know they taught me the other math.

Natascha: And we talked a little bit about your inspirations being nature. Are there other inspirations that come through in your design work and your art?

Ember: I mean, if we’re going to do something like a collab piece, there’s different things that’ll create inspiration. If we’re going to do lighting for somebody’s house. Okay. I love doing that, too. [dream-like] What’s going to make their house look beautiful, you know? Yeah.

Willow: That’s always fun. Envisioning color palettes in lighting. They’re made in layers. So, we start with white on the inside, and then we put down other colors. And then we put down other colors over that. And then the light is inside shining out. So, you’re seeing that radiate out. So, you’re really seeing this like matrix of layers of glass and transparent colors over opaque colors over different other colors, you know, with spaces and gaps in between. So, you can create something that’s like, really cool and create a whole effect in somebody’s house. You know, I think that was really a fun thing to do. You can really, uh, really it ties the room together, you know?

Ember: Well, and it’s just also knowing you’re making this functional piece that’s going to be part of people’s lives every day and light their world… In glass it looks amazing.

Willow: Yeah, I love glass.

Willow: Um. Uh oh. I almost knocked the bong over.

Natascha: Before getting into glassblowing, what other forms of art were you guys involved in?

Ember: I think that I did all kinds of art growing up my whole life. My dad’s a really awesome artist and a painter and sculptor. And my mom had us involved in doing all kinds of arts and crafts. That’s how our family communicated. That’s how our family got along. I don’t know, I feel pretty blessed that was my world growing up, because I think that carries over into my life and my kids’ lives that I get to share that love with them. And I’ve always said if I wasn’t working in glass, I’d be working in another medium. Whatever’s available out there, I would grab and want to make stuff with it. So, I don’t know. I feel like I’m really blessed to get to work with glass, but also working with anything that’s out there in your world that you can see, like you can make art out of anything, everything. And that’s one of the amazing things about it, just go outside and look around you. If you can’t make it outside, look around your house, make art out of something you have. I, yeah, I think that I guess.

What did I do before? Let’s see before. Right before I got into glass, I was making jewelry using glass beads, and I was like, fuck, I want to make my own glass beads. I don’t want to use other people’s glass beads. These beads were from all over wherever, you know, and I wasn’t feeling conscious about that. I was like, I want to make my own glass jewelry with my own glass beads. So I took, uh, glass bead-making class in college. And back then, I mean, there wasn’t hardly any glass classes or anything hardly going on. It was like, uh, this couple came over. He had designed some, like, head for the map gas. And we all, like, used map gas to make beads. And we stuck them in vermiculite and, um.

Willow: Low tech.

Ember: Very, very low tech. So that’s why when people say, oh, I don’t have enough money to set up a situation to blow glass, I kind of feel like, just like that. Go back to that first time that I blew glass, and, it took nothing; but it took a metal rod, some bead release, some vermiculite and a metal bucket and a little Mapp gas with an airhead on it and I made glass beads. And that’s because I think that there’s that whole situation. If you really want to do it, don’t wait, don’t wait till you have that big, thick thing of money. Don’t wait. Take that little bit and start and let it grow.

Ember: Crazy.

Natascha: Cool. So, do you guys sell your artwork in Wyoming as well?

Willow: Yes, we did.

Natascha: Are there other locations where you guys display your art?

Willow: Let’s see, we have our artwork at Ph Glass, Plaid Hemp Company. They have five locations in Wyoming. You can buy some of our functional pieces and we sell our other work. On our Facebook page or off of our Instagram.

Ember: Yeah. I have a proto line that I’ve sold to different shops.

Willow: Mary Jane House of Glass.

Ember: They have 19 stores throughout Washington and Oregon. Ash Denton has some of my pieces he picked up at Vegas.

Willow: Xhale City. They have 29 stores in Georgia, and they have a bunch of our glass.

Ember: So, I think it’s all over the place. It’s all over.

Willow: But if you want, like, you can just hit us up in the DMs. That’s what the kids say. Yeah. And we’ll be happy to make something for anybody. And we’re almost ready to have people out taking classes.

Ember: Yeah. And we’re happy to start doing custom orders.

Willow: Custom orders, all this stuff.

Ember: And we should be doing classes, hopefully. You know, I think it’s going to take us probably another few weeks. 3 or 4 weeks, I would say. And then we can maybe start doing class. Actually depends on the weather. If we get a lot of rain, it might be too muddy. But if the weather stays gorgeous like this. Yeah, that’ll be amazing.

Willow: If it dries out a little bit. It’ll be perfect.

Ember: But eventually that’s our big plan, you know, that we see in our future is being able to set this place up so people can come out here. We especially want to start a community out here where maybe we’re working with underprivileged youth and kids at risk and being able to have kids out here where they can be part of nature, relax and maybe get in touch with their spiritually motivated passions, and art forms that we can see all around us. And being able to share that with them and hopefully get them in the glass shop, experiencing that as a medium. One of the things I love about it is that we can make it super fun, super simple. You don’t have to play the concert right off. You know, you can make some just really happy, fun things that just bring you joy. And I want to share that with people.

Natascha: I love your passion for the community. Right on. You kind of talked about this, but I recall your previous location in Old Town, Eureka. It was a glass shop with a studio in the back. What motivated you guys to move into this current space?

Ember: We’ve always had this dream about having Glass Camp, so we had that place in our studio over there in Eureka for ten years, and it was an awesome spot. We’re super, proud of everything that we got to do there and make happen, and all the classes and people that came through. We still feel really connected to that. But also at the same time, after the ten years we were there we felt like we could offer more. I think that us having this dream of Glass Camp and still sharing our passion when this place came up and was offered, we thought this was just the best place to grow a glass camp because it’s beautiful. It’s really not that far outside of many towns around here. We’re 20 minutes from Fortuna. We’re still only 40 minutes from the old glass shop. All that’s going to happen is you’re going to come out here instead of the place in town, you’re going to breathe fresh air. You’re going to relax and I feel like you’re just going to be able to get more in touch with that artist side of yourself, you know? And I don’t know, for me, I think it’s just bringing that good quality to life, to ourselves, our friends, our family, and sharing it with the community.

Natascha: You have the Eel River right here in the backyard?

Willow & Ember: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Willow: We got riverfront.

Ember: In the summer. We’re hoping to make a path down to the river. People can picnic, you know, and enjoy the water.

Willow: There’s kind of a path now.

Ember: We’re working on it a little.

Natascha: I admire how you’re growing everything from the bottom up. It’s too cool.

Willow: We were when we got here. It was like camping. We were camping here. It was. It was crazy.

Ember: Yeah, it was awesome.

Natascha: Can you give me a verbal visualization of what the new studio space might look like.

Willow: Oh, let’s see, right now it’s a 46-foot by 8.5ft wide. Refrigerated Safeway semi-trailer truck. Awesome, right? So, we put the shop in there. It’s ugly too, by the way. It is not a pretty one.

Ember: We’re gonna paint it.

Willow: She’s ugly, but you gotta have the vision. The current state on the outside is like, wow, that truck’s seen some miles, right?

Ember: We’re taking artistic designs right now for the outside of the truck. You never know. It could be like some amazing mural that we’re gonna put on there. That’s magic.

Willow: That’s exactly. The vision inside of there is, the very back is like a co-working room where we can do lapidary and polishing and cold cutting with the saw and all that kind of stuff. Ventilated, separate back area. And then there’s a spot where Ember’s torch and my torch are right together in there. And then there’s a spot where the lathe will go right next to that. And then after that, it’s kind of like another [Marvin. Leave her alone. (Talking about the dog)] Another long table where we’re going to have room for classes up to four people at a time. And then after that, on the end is hippie Chris. He has his spot right there. And so, there’s another side of the shop [Ember: That, Dave’s in there], and Dave’s in there as well with his torch.

Ember: We’re gonna bump it out…

Willow: We’re bumping it. Right. So that’s all on one side of the truck on the other side is pretty much an open wall, except we have our color rack somewhere in there, but we don’t know exactly where it goes. But we just got a sliding glass door that’s seven feet wide by 80in tall. So that’s pretty fucking tall, right? And it’s a sliding glass door. [Talking about the dog: Marvin. No, Marvin. He’s really. He’s really. Yeah. He likes people.] Uh, anyway, uh, yeah, it’s seven feet, seven feet wide. We got this big ass sliding glass door. And then, uh, right next to that, we have this other giant windows like we have in our house there, that eight foot wide by 2.5ft tall windows. We’re gonna put that right in next to it. And so we’re gonna then build a deck out there. But we have two trucks, right. You can’t see the other one. We have another one that was a Salvation Army, donation truck. She’s 32ft. That one actually has paperwork, man. It’s a pretty fucking nice truck.

Ember: We had a way to drive it. We could take it places. She’s a pretty nice truck. That’s part of a dream further down the line, now that…

Willow: -Now that the rain is over. Right. So, like, what we’ll do is where they’re at. They’re just parked parallel to each other. But we’re gonna move the salvation truck out of the way, take the big truck and slide it down like 10 or 20- as many 20fts as we can do down that way. And then we’re gonna turn the Salvation Army truck the other way. So it’s back end is like that, and it makes like a L or a T or wherever the fuck it fits. Right. And then…

Ember: –we can have a nice big deck.

Willow: Now we’re in that L pocket, we can hang out.

Ember: People can even hang out and watch glass blowing through the big sliding glass door or window.

Willow: Yeah, with the deck outside it.

Ember: You know, people want to go out and smoke. You can still watch us. You can still gather out there, create a really nice space.

Willow: With like a covered area. So that way people have an outdoor (area). Even in the winter, it might be pretty cool. And then we could even have an entrance into the other truck from the other side of the alley, you know. But they’re still trucks, so they’re temporary and they’re on wheels, and the decks won’t be attached to the buildings. They’ll be two inches apart.

Ember: Right next to it.

Willow: So, they’re temporary. And the county, you know, we’ll follow all the county guidelines because we’re like in a floodplain. So, we can’t like do build like that. We’ve had to kind of figure out all these other ways what’s allowed, what’s not allowed. We wanted…

Ember: -we wanted creativity.

Willow: …shipping containers, and then have an upstairs and all that. But then the county was like, no, you can’t have shipping containers. So, we had to get rid of our shipping containers. And then we got-

Ember: I know we’re lucky they took them back.

Willow: -semi trucks- I know.

Ember: We bought them locally, luckily. We wouldn’t have been able to do that if we bought them you know (big corp)…

Willow: And the people were super cool. They helped us find the semi-truck.

Willow: And the truck driver guy. He even went and got the semi-truck trailers and brought them here for us in the rain. And it was like right when the trucker parade was, yeah, Kenny, Kenny Howard, he’s awesome. And Travis and Cousin Travis, they both had an excavator and a semi-truck, and they got this.

Ember: They got the big rig stuff.

Willow: Yeah, they brought them in here and it was already Mud City. And Kenny got his big-

Ember: They moved our houses.

Willow: Yeah, they moved our houses. We couldn’t be over there because of the neighbors. So, Travis has, like, a big thing with a flatbed that moves, and we cut our houses in half because now they’re ten by 12, so they’re 120ft² under. You know, you guys can’t be over 120ft² without a permit.

Natascha: So, you’re following all the rules.

Willow: We cut them in half. Now we have 220ft². And Travis is awesome [Ember: I know]. He brought them all the way over here and put them back on the pure blocks.

Ember: Anyway, the shop’s going to be awesome when we get it together. Yeah, but it’s-

Willow: But it’s on wheels.

Natascha: It’s a party I wanted to attend. That sounds really cool.

Ember: Yeah, yeah. We’re gonna have little Christmas lights. It’s gonna be really nice.

Natascha: Does Soulshine have a motto or a guiding principle?

Willow: Oh, she’s got all those. You got all the good ones. Be the ripple. Uh, what was your?

Ember: Be the ripple.

Willow: Let your soul shine.

Ember: Why dream small when you can dream big? Yeah. And it’s I don’t know if you know. Remember, I don’t know. We have a lot of, um.

Ember + Willow: Lot of them. Shoot.

Willow: Stay lit.

Ember + Willow: Stay.

Willow: Stay lit, folks.

Ember: Yeah.

And, you know, don’t settle for the life that you have.

-Ember

If you don’t love it, you know, that’s part of dreaming big. What is the best vision of your life that you can envision? And when you see that, follow it, find that, follow it and don’t give it up. Just keep that in your vision. And I believe that it will keep unfolding in every, every fold that happens is like another part of that. So, you can see it. You can see it happening, you can see how close it is. Just wait. It will keep getting closer. And the other part of that is, is that’s going to keep changing. Just staying fluid in your art and staying fluid in your life and not just sticking to one thing, because there’s going to be times when you need those other things that you know and have learned and experienced or want to. Being able to stay fluid makes those new places happen.

Natascha: Those words resonate with me. Can you share some of the challenges you face in the glassblowing process or even within the business?

Willow: Glassblowing is just part of the business. Everybody thinks, oh, if I could learn to blow glass and I could learn to do this technique or make that kind of product, I could just be rich or I could make it and be successful. But really you have to be smart. You got to be a business person first. The glassblowing part is important and is why you do it. It’s what you’re passionate about, but it’s not what makes it happen.

You know what makes it happen is being a smart business person and knowing how to market yourself.

-Willow

Uh, a great artist with a shitty marketing department is not going to make it or is not going to really make it, you know, in any kind of way that’s able to put the kids through college and pay their bills. But crappy artists with a great marketing department and a really good photographer are gonna go far, you know, it’s just the way it is. And so, you have to find balance in what you want your life to be, or else you have to have good partners or friends or whatever to handle. You have to have a team, you know what I mean? And that takes different kind of business sense.

Ember + Willow: It’s hard.

Ember: It’s a hard job being an artist. You have to have a lot of hats.

Ember + Willow: There’s a lot of-

Ember: Hats, a lot of hats to wear.

Willow: A lot of pieces to the pie that all have to be able to come together – where the rubber meets the road, you know what I mean? Like, can you buy food? Can you buy gas? Can you live a way that you feel like you’re comfortable, whatever that level is that you need? You know, like I’ve seen artists find all those things. Like everybody, it’s different for every person. Some people just want to go out in the garage and make cool things and be inspired, because it doesn’t matter who you are, whether you’ve had a 30-minute marble-making class and you’re sitting there on the torch staring at that fire, trying to keep the little ball of goo from falling on the table or whatever the fuck. Or you’ve been doing it for 30 years and ten-million hours behind the torch or behind the fire in some way or another. That experience that high, that whatever- Like that experience. That ride is the same thing. That’s the same rush, that’s the same euphoria or catharsis or whatever.

I was having a really shitty day. I was really depressed. And then all of a sudden I, like, juggled the ball of goo and I can’t even remember why I was upset. And now I’m just like, whoa, look, I didn’t drop the ball of goo, right? And it’s like, it’s so simple, you know what I mean? But, like, it doesn’t matter why you blow glass or why you do that. Because if you juggle the ball of goo, you’re gonna feel that kind of experience. And it’s always the same. And I think that’s pretty cool. It transcends- glassblowing is like a staircase. Everybody’s on the staircase. Some people just started moving up before you. And some people do it every day for ten hours a day. And some people do it once a week or once a month, and everybody’s on that staircase. But everybody’s like, feeling that same feeling every time they go up the next step. Right? That same rush, that same, it’s fucking amazing. That’s if you can find a way to do that and pay your fucking rent, drop the mic right there. And it takes a lot. It takes a lot, I think. I think it’s like that with any art though.  You can’t just expect because you can make cool art, that you’re gonna be able to sell it and make a living. And I’m gonna have a nice house and a picket fence, and their dog’s gonna be cute, and everything’s gonna be cool, you know what I mean? Like, yeah, I think that’s a great idea.

Natascha: It’s hard.

Ember: That’s just a fairy tale thing. Yeah, you know, it is. Life is hard work. If you really, really want something and it’s worth having, then you have to work a little bit for it. Yeah, maybe you have to work really hard for it and you-

Willow: –gotta keep working.

Ember: And maybe you have to work harder than you’ve ever worked in your whole life, but eventually you’ll get past that and it’s worth all that hard work.

Willow: And then you might have to start.

Natascha: I saw that when I met you guy. You put a lot of work into your relationship and into your art and to your business, and I see that.

Willow: It’s pretty amazing. You gotta really want something really bad. You know? You gotta really want something.

Ember: I think it takes that to make it through like those hard times, you know?

Willow: That’s the secret sauce right there. You just gotta really, really want that super bad and just do whatever it takes every day. You know, the successful artists aren’t the one that make a really badass piece of art. You go to like, the, we go to Glass Vegas, right? This big boiler silicate flameworking show all the big artists, everybody, all the everybody’s there. Big guys, small guys, famous guys, every guy, every guy, every girl, every amazing glass artist that’s in the scene. They’re all there. And there’s like a whole area in the beginning when you walk in with all this crazy ass amazing stuff, you’re like, holy fucking shit, right? Blows you away. And the best artists aren’t the ones that can make something like that. The best artists, the ones that can, like, make something and then on Monday morning, go back in the studio and make something again. And then in the morning, go back in the studio and make something again. And you know what I mean? Like, that’s what makes it, your ability to make art and then go back again and make something again. Whether it’s like coming up with another incredible idea that you’re passionate about for a whole new project that you’re gonna start all over again or what?

Ember: That’s where the whole world and whole community of glass comes in. I think that there’s many cogs on the wheel that in, like, art, it’s not one way, it’s not one person. It’s many ideas and many people and all of them are valid, and all of them have value and are amazing because, like, some of those big art pieces are truly, truly works of art. That person had a vision and they probably drew it out and they got together with multiple people and they made that dream happen. They made that come true. And so when we do go to that place in World Cup of Champions and of glass, you know, anywhere, and there’s so many of them, you know, in different types of glass. Yeah. Uh, admiration and, you know. No thought of you know what, what does that person actually do to make their money? I’ve just, like, in awe of, uh, how somebody can just dream their dream and make it in their medium. And it’s a piece of beauty that just makes me feel inspiration to be able to make people feel that and everyone gets to admire that. I think that’s what keeps helping them push us all forward in our medium. Wherever you’re at, if you’re wanting to just do proto if you want to do, you know, big art pieces or you just want to do your little thing. Either way, that inspiration of what can be is out there for us to see. And that’s what keeps pushing our community of borrow glass workers forward. It keeps pushing not just our artists, but it also keeps pushing, more than that; our tools, our colors, it all keeps moving forward, you know, and that is fucking community of glass. That is not just one person, not ten. It’s a huge worldwide community. And it is amazing.

Ember + Willow: Yeah.

Ember: Magic. There’s magic.

Natascha: You really hit my next question on the head, I was going to ask about the glassblowing community. Is there anything you wanted to add about the glassblowing community to help somebody that’s not in it, understand what that community looks like?

Ember + Willow: Mhm. Ah.

Willow: I think there’s a lot of people that see people from the outside looking in in the beginning, like artists that have been successful for a long period of time. And they seem to set wierd milestones based on what they see from artists who maybe have been doing it for 40,000 hours of time. And here somebody starts something and they have a good talent, but they get frustrated because they can’t compete with somebody that has 40,000 hours of practice ahead of you. And so I think that there’s a lot of like highs and lows in setting realistic expectations. Like if you want to blow glass to make money, you could blow glass for about three weeks. Learn like a set few things like how to make a little pendant, how to make a little marble, how to make a little league, you know, doodly bopper. And like, you could open up a pendant marble doodly bopper fucking mega domain on the internet and pay your kid’s college education, right? If you want to blow glass because you’re passionate about it, you just want to learn and grow and improve, and you don’t set those kinds of barriers to your own learning in front of you, then it’s a better ride. You know what I mean? Like, I don’t know, uh, because I think, I think a lot of people, they just see, like, all these things, I want to be able to do this or I want to be able to do that, and that’s all cool. You could do that and you could maybe make money doing that. But you can also do these really easy this, this, this and this make a bunch of money and then you can pay and afford to be able to do whatever your heart (desires).

Ember + Willow: Yeah.

Ember: Because all those little things are your practice. Yeah. Those are your small practice. It’s like your small meditation every day. That really comfortable zone where you’re like relaxed, you’re comfortable, and meditation starts happening. It’s that way for the glass when you’re starting, and it’s just comfortable with that small pendant and doing it again and again and again. And pretty soon meditation is happening and you’re not really thinking about so much what you’re doing. You’re just-

Willow: –just meditating. Meditating is huge. Breathing is-

Ember + Willow: -big.

Willow: Breathing with the glass.

I think once the glass starts moving, learning to time your rhythmic breathing in with the glass as you’re working, I find is really important for me, breathing through it.

-Willow

Otherwise, I notice I’m like getting really into something and I’m holding my breath and I’m like. And I’m tense and my shoulders are turning and my arms are working and my neck is tense as fuck. All in this contorted, really weird position. Or maybe I’m trying to use gravity in different ways, so I’m contorting my body and all kinds of angles in order to push the glass one way or the other. And if I don’t breathe out, I’m like, otherwise, I’m holding my breath and gritting my teeth and it’s-

Ember: Like, you don’t breathe, you could faint.

Willow: Yeah, you could go down. You saw that one go down. That guy go down one time. But he was kind of a dick.

Ember: Oh, yeah.

Willow: That guy went down anyway.

Ember + Willow: Wasn’t breathing.

Willow: No, he just was holding his breath. It got too hot. He was kind of a jerk. So, it happened.

Ember: Too many heats.

Ember: But that was in the, uh, in-

Willow: the hot shot. It was really hot that day.

Willow: Anyway.

Willow: We tried to tell him to breathe.

Ember + Willow: Shit.

Natascha: I think you got a full circle around the community. Thank you. [laughter] Yeah.

Willow: The glass community is all different people, though. There’s a lot of different people. There’s so many kinds of glass. There’s a million different…

Ember + Willow: -directions.

Willow: You can go. And each one involves a very deep fucking rabbit hole that you could suck you in for your whole life. Each one. Or you could pull out and say, I’m gonna be the jack of all trades, and I’m gonna, like, go down this rabbit hole and this one and this one, and then I’m gonna start combining rabbit holes together.

Ember: I’m a rabbit.

Willow: And so, it just depends on how many rabbit holes you want to go down. But there’s a different community for every rabbit hole. And then there’s a bigger, broader community of glass, and then there’s a bigger, broader community. It just depends on what you’re looking for. Some people just want to hang out in their garage and make cool shit. They’re gonna get the same high as the other people. Whatever you’re looking for in life, if you just look for it.

Ember: It’s a big community of people who are just people. Yeah, just like when you go out in the world, you’re going to meet all kinds of people. It’s like that in the glass community.

Willow: Yeah.

Willow: Not everybody likes licorice. Some people like licorice. They really like licorice. 

[Natascha looks really confused]

Ember: You gotta think about that one.

Natascha: As talented of artists, as you guys are yourselves. Are there any other artists you particularly admire in this trade?

Ember + Willow: Oh.

Willow: So many, so many. Like in glass in general or in, I think that in the studio glass movement, I think Dale Chihuly and Lino Tagliapietra and Dante Marioni are like the three artists in that direction. Uh, William Gudenrath.

Ember + Willow: Mhm.

Willow: Yeah. I mean, and then if you look at Boris silicate glass, there’s just so many uh, Marvin.

Ember + Willow: Marvin.

Ember: Marvin, Windstar. Roger Paramore, Banjo.

Ember: I’ve, I personally, girl fan out on some female glassblowers because it’s a male-dominated medium.

Willow: It is definitely a boys club.

Ember: I’ve noticed throughout the time I’ve been with glass that it is a boy’s club. It’s hard to even get in. It’s hard to even learn as a female glassblower. It’s getting, it’s changing and it’s changed, I think, a lot in the last ten years. But before then, it’s been really difficult for female glassblowers to not only be respected, that’s been lacking and still does in our community, but also sharing is different. Sometimes a lot of guys get together and, you know, maybe they can communicate together, but communicating with, uh, female that you’re kind of sometimes not in the big circle of, of everything. And so that’s been, I think, really challenging. As a female glassblower, I enjoy teaching because I want other women who have experienced that to experience more freedom. I want female community glassblowers to share. I would like to see there be more of a female glassblowing presence together and stronger. And there is that small group, but it’s really like a part of a little bit of a, you know, echelon group, which are, you know, people that I fan out on. So, you know, it’s okay.

Natascha: Can you name a few (female glassblowers)?

Ember: I really love Windstar. I, right now, I hope I don’t slaughter her name, Sibelley. She hasn’t been blowing glass very long, but she was able to move really far in the glass world. And I admire that about her. And I like that she’s moved around a lot, and she’s doing well. And she recently got a job teaching at Corning. And, fuck, I think it’s amazing. And she’s pretty young also. All different glass of flowers that I, like, admire. I love Kelly Howard, who has the Lincoln City glassblowing place right there in Oregon. I love what she did, and I love that she is a female glassblower. It’s fucking empowering.

Natascha: Okay. We only have one more question and this is the silliest. This is the one that I came up with last night before I printed everything and drove out. So, this one’s just for fun. If you see a shift of consciousness already happening in our world, what is it?

Ember: Uh, shift of consciousness is, I see it as a change in community. I think people are moving into from a physical community to an online communities. And so, I worry about the importance of being- eye contact, one-on-one, the importance of touch, the importance of hug, the importance of knowing people, truly knowing them. Because when we sit across from each other and this one-on-one, or even multiples, when we sit across from each other and we talk and we communicate and we share, we get to share so much more. We’re not only using our voice and our ears, but we’re also using what body language people use. The eye contact, just even the vibe, the feel, the energy that moves between us all; life, everything is energy. And I worry about us missing that. And that’s part of us wanting to have a community space and glass that we get to share. And, you know, we’re like- really- open to having all kinds of art and artists also sharing. So, you know, it moves beyond in creating more of that one-on-one community with each other. I think there’s a reason why we move in and out of each other’s lives. I think noticing the importance of that and the value in that, I think creates a bigger and better love for the community and each other. And I think that that’s what’s starting to move out of us all. And I don’t want that.

Natascha: Beautiful. Anything to add? Hello? Nope. It’s okay. You don’t have to.

Ember: What are we talking about again?

Natascha: The shift in consciousness.

Willow: Well, I think people are waking up. Some people are waking up and other people are resisting because their focus is maybe not ready for change, but I think there’s a lot of people waking up. I think there’s a lot of big things that are going to happen. And I think. Yeah. You got to be a warrior, though. This is great weed, right?

Natascha: Yes.

Ember: Maybe you’re in for the long haul, but that the part that really is, is not, not that you’d be at war, but that you be at peace. That you be at love, that you be open. Yeah. That you be open to the universe. To be open to love, share love, give love. One fucking smile can change somebody’s life in one moment. In one moment, that person could have needed that. Just one small gift didn’t cost you a penny, but you gave it and they respond back. Man, you know you did something. You know you changed something. The energy of that one person, they give back to you when they notice that your energy, you vibe, that energy, I don’t know. But the energy of being in touch with that energy of us all being together. That buzz, that fucking beehive.

Willow: What she said. Yeah.

Ember: Love, love.

Natascha: Well, thank you so much, Soulshine, for offering me your time, trusting me with your space, and sitting down for this interview. I hope that the Humboldt County community gets some really great information from this. And thank you to everyone who comes to visit my blog.

Ember: Thank you for having us.

Willow: Yeah. Thank you.